[00:00:00] Hello and welcome to the Thrive Podcast series. I'm your host, Wayne Schwass. Thrive is Monash Health's employee mental health and wellbeing program created for our people by our people. Our bespoke program explores the themes of validating that working in healthcare is uniquely challenging, normalising the conversation about mental health, encouraging pause for rest, reflection and regeneration, and creating safe spaces that empower our people to speak up.
[00:00:32] In this series, we talk with some of our people about what this means for them through storytelling and their shared experiences in the hope that that may be helpful to others. In today's episode, I sit down with Hannah Humphreys, Registered Nurse and Clinical Midwife Specialist, and Melissa De Luca, Nurse Manager to discuss the role of language and support in creating an environment where employees can feel comfortable raising their mental health and wellbeing needs.
[00:00:58] I hope you enjoyed the episode. Hannah, I think it's important to start the conversation. You know, this is a big organisation. You've got people that you know really well, but there would be a lot of people that may not be aware that you've been dealing with some challenging health obstacles. If you are comfortable, please only share what you are comfortable sharing.
[00:01:21] But just to set some context here, um, what, what, what has the last couple of years meant for you and what's it been like with regards to the things that you are. Working your way through and and navigating.
[00:01:32] So I'm, I'm a nurse and a midwife. I work in nursing at Merab and as a midwife at Clayton. And during my graduate year, I was diagnosed as stage three melanoma.
[00:01:42] Um, and because of that I had four months off as I started, um, some targeted therapy. Treatment. Very, very happy. Very lucky to get the no evidence of disease midwife through 2022. Um, and then at the end of 2022 in December, um, I found out that I had stage four melanoma, uh, where a brain tumor had been found.
[00:02:05] Um, and of course with that, um, some pretty immediate time off, no longer able to drive. Um. Of course, Christmas period with annual leave and all the rest makes it extra tricky. Um, but that's what I've been working with. And then, um, since, uh, January of 2023, I got again the no evidence of disease, which is very exciting.
[00:02:30] Um, and then since then have been, uh, under surveillance, uh, just to make sure that nothing else pops up. And if we do that, we're catching it nice and early. Tackling it from there.
[00:02:40] Well, we like the no evidence, don't we?
[00:02:42] Yeah. Love it.
[00:02:43] A a follow up question for you again, Hannah. How has language played a role in helping you navigate your way through the challenges that you've had to face?
[00:02:51] Yeah, I think that the hardest part of any challenge in life, any challenging diagnosis is always the, the how do you tell people? Um, and I know for me, that's always the one thing that I dread. Obviously hearing bad news puts a pit in your stomach, but then the idea of having to tell other people and then to be that bad news for others, um, is never the most uplifting thing in the world.
[00:03:20] Um. So in terms of the language itself, like I know that from my own healthcare team, I appreciate how straightforward they are with me and, and meeting me where I am at the time. Um, and then that's obviously we all work in healthcare, so it really wasn't much of a surprise when my. Workplaces have done the exact same thing in, in meeting me where I am, um, and having those open and honest conversations and just being really transparent through it all.
[00:03:51] I had the pleasure of meeting you two recently in the lead up to this conversation, and clearly there's a great relationship, both personally and professionally. You have a lot of fun. You do laugh, which I think is infectious. Melissa, same question to you. You're, you're a colleague, a friend, a manager. Um, with Hannah, how important is language, both yours and hers, with regards to navigating your collective way through the professional requirements, but also the care that you clearly extend to somebody you care a lot about?
[00:04:22] So, I guess Hannah's been very open with, um, her conversations with me. Um, and I need to. Make sure I have the time for the conversations that I am not rushed, that I can give Hannah the time that she needs, um, to be able to express what she needs from me at the end of the conversation. I think it's important to.
[00:04:45] Establish, uh, I guess where Hannah wanted me to take that conversation in terms of did she wanna kept private, um, did she want the team to know about it, um, and how I could support her. Um. It is a fine line between being professional and being a manager, but at the end of the day, I guess I'm human. I'm a mom.
[00:05:09] Um, Hannah's similar age to my daughter, and I guess I treated her as one of my children and supported her as best I can.
[00:05:17] Can you share, Melissa, how the team. Rallied around Hannah when she was first diagnosed as a graduate, wasn't able to drive. What type of things did the team do to support her during that difficult period?
[00:05:31] When Hannah was a grad, she was, she came back, but we had to do like, um, for example, shift work. We didn't want Hannah being tight, so we established what would work for her if it was a week of late, a week of early is no night to be so we could support her in rostering. That was a very simple. Easy thing to do, you know?
[00:05:50] Did you need two days on, two days off, two days on, um, with the second diagnosis, with the, um. Recurrence in the brain. Then we had to look at what she needed in terms of how is she going to get to work, um, what is she safe to do, how can we modify, um, her tasks at work. So she still feels valued. She still needed, um, and it was handy that she came back in February with new grads.
[00:06:15] So, um, both areas were able to use her as an educator 'cause she has a great wealth of knowledge. She's very patient and she's kind, so she's exactly what new nurses need. Um, and it supported the team as well. Hmm. They're the sorts of things we could do. The team got behind Hannah. They would pick her up for her shifts, drop her home.
[00:06:34] Hmm. I don't know. That sort of thing. Yeah. So that's how we supported her.
[00:06:39] How did that make you feel when people were prepared to do that for you? Hannah. And how important has that been for you?
[00:06:46] It's not a shock to me. It wasn't surprising to me. I know that in both areas, in nursing and in midwifery, I work with amazing teams, and that's why I'm still.
[00:06:56] Working here and, and still loving it here. Um, so it wasn't surprising, but again, it's, it's a massive change going from having that independence and, and just doing it yourself in, in your own timing to now all of a sudden having people who are willing to go outta their way to help you out. Even if, you know, when I wasn't able to drive before my surgery, I had colleagues come.
[00:07:19] Come to me at home and take me to do my grocery shopping with me and just be that, you know, companionship as well. 'cause as soon as you can't get somewhere, then all of a sudden, you know, it's not just your professional life that you've lost, it's also a bit of that social life. So it wasn't shocking, but it still is so incredibly heartwarming, um, to really see like the proof in the pudding that.
[00:07:44] I work with incredible people.
[00:07:45] How important has it been for you, Hannah, to have a colleague in Melissa, uh, a friend, but also a manager, uh, walking the journey with you over a challenging few years, respecting the fact that it's your journey. But clearly what's obvious to me is the genuine care that Melissa has for you and extends to you consistently.
[00:08:08] It. Makes it so much easier every time there's a scan or, or something that, you know, might pop up unexpectedly. I just know that as much as I hate having the conversations and no one ever loves doing it, um, it's something that is needed to be done. And I know that in reality it is really easy. Um, so it does take away.
[00:08:32] A little bit of that worry and, and one less thing to stress about. Um, but Mel has definitely gone above and beyond taking me to my radiation and sitting through all of those scans as well on annual leave. Um, which again, I probably wouldn't have been able to get there 'cause I wasn't able to drive. So it was, again, just a massive.
[00:08:53] Weight off my shoulders and sort of one thing that when your brain is going so many different places, that you just don't have to worry about those specific jobs. So I think that at the time it just was so easy and even now, so easy. And I, I'll take that any day.
[00:09:13] Melissa, you mentioned something before, which I think is really important, but it's also, uh, incredibly valuable and.
[00:09:21] What I, what I'm keen to just get you to unpack a little bit more is, is you mentioned that you are really deliberate in trying to understand what Hannah needs in a given conversation or situation. So I'm interested to understand. I'm a father of three kids and I tend to go to solution or problem solving mode.
[00:09:38] But is that a skillset that, and I think that that's a trap for a lot of people, but has that been something that you've been, uh, conscious of, you've developed or you've always had that ability to try and understand what's the intention here and what is my role in that?
[00:09:53] When I go into the conversation, obviously the first conversation took me hugely by surprise.
[00:09:59] Um, and with that, we sort of just unpacked that conversation as we moved along that day. But I guess from that. I often reflect what I think Hannah May need. Um, and then either we have follow up conversations, um, but I kind of know, I guess being a nurse and knowing what she would need. Um, and I know, you know, Hannah's family, for example, are in the country, so her support, like her family supports aren't easily accessible.
[00:10:33] So, um, we have those, I guess those conversations and, um, how it's very easy to talk to and open and, um, I think sometimes we just blunder our way through together, um, and, and work it out. Yeah. Yeah. I think, um,
[00:10:51] I think that. Really asking very clearly as well in those conversations of, um, you know, what, what do you need from me?
[00:10:59] I know there's been so many times where you've asked that Melon have taken massive jobs off my plate of, you know. How on earth am I gonna tell everyone I work with? Um, and obviously no one likes doing that, so when you offered, of course I'm going to accept. Um, but yeah, just really, really clearly and explicitly asking has always been something that I've found.
[00:11:22] Really helpful.
[00:11:23] I wanna pick up on what you've just talked about there, Hannah, that, uh, Melissa offered to talk and to provide updates with people. Melissa, that's not an easy position or responsibility to assume. So how did you manage to communicate the update in a way that honored Hannah and what she was comfortable with you sharing, but also deliver it in a way that is.
[00:11:50] Not completely overwhelming to the people that are receiving the information.
[00:11:54] Yeah. So when Hannah, uh, when I spoke to Hannah, I, uh, obviously asked if she wanted me to share this, and she did. Um, so I actually came and spoke to my manager first so I could unpack things with her and debrief, um, about how I would approach this.
[00:12:12] It was. Probably a Thursday or Friday afternoon, just before a period of long service leave. Um, so my time, it wasn't something I could just let, you know, drag on. I had to get this over and done with. Um, so I pulled my leadership team aside first and informed them. Um, and then I had, we did our, I guess, debriefing and.
[00:12:38] Our crying and everything, and then we moved on to the next step. I had their backs, they had mine. Um, we went into handover. I, we called in the staff that were on shift that day, um, and shared it with the team. Um, you know, and it was probably quite youthful that Hannah wasn't on site that day because the team was able to process the news in their own time and in their own space without worrying about Hannah and.
[00:13:05] How their reaction was impacting Hannah,
[00:13:08] it's admirable. You have an ally like Melissa, who's willing to shoulder some of that emotional luggage, uh, when you need to, or you want to provide people with an update of the status of where things are. I, I think that that, that, that for me is arguably one of the greatest displays of leadership.
[00:13:28] And I'm not saying that to embarrass you, Melissa, but I think that's incredible leadership that you're willing to do that. But you've, you've, you've had to. Somehow find a way to ensure that there's two teams that Hannah works with at two different locations. If it's not challenging enough with one group of people, you've, you've done a really good job of extending that and involving.
[00:13:52] Another group of people at the two locations that Hannah works with. So how have you managed that?
[00:13:58] Well, I guess the first bit was Hannah. She had to speak to her manager over in the midwifery manager. Um, so they had to do it there as well, I suppose. Um, but then the. Bringing Hannah back to work and return to work plans and all those sorts of things.
[00:14:14] We worked together to, um, make sure we were aligned with how best to manage this and how best to support Hannah. Um, that our rosters were complimenting each other because, you know, two different rosters, two different workplaces. So there's challenges on the, on the good days without, um, throwing in these return to work kind of plans.
[00:14:36] Um, but. We've just all worked together and as I said, Hannah's very easy to work with and open, so that helps as well.
[00:14:44] How has it helped you and your journey, both personally and professionally to be able to see clearly the level of care and genuine support that the teams have shown you and continue to show you?
[00:14:59] Oh, I think just the, the trust that was already there with my team has just increased. So, so, so much. Um, I knew already that I worked with amazing teams who worked in a person centered and a woman centered way, um, in midwifery. Um, but to see that so clearly role modeled and to feel how well supported that makes you feel, um, both on a like personal and a professional level.
[00:15:31] I think that if anything, it's just. Made my professional work so much better because it, it's very, very easy to know exactly where, uh, where my patients, where my women are coming from and, and the. Insecurities that you feel in those moments. It's really hard to go from the, that independence to now accepting help.
[00:15:58] And so the, it is such an honor to be able, be able to care for the people that we care for on, on both accounts. Um, and if anything, I just enjoy working with, with my colleagues even more to be able to sort of instill that. Sense and to try and encourage people to keep doing the work that they're doing and taking the time and taking the time to listen and to just genuinely care.
[00:16:25] Because as a patient, it can change everything. Um, and so when we're already doing it on those hard days, often you just need that extra, that smile, the, a little bit more encouragement to just keep it going. Um, so if anything, it just sort of. Makes me wanna stay more a part of the team and just to keep, keep things moving.
[00:16:49] So how do you manage your own mental health and wellbeing so that you are in a good position and you're well placed to continue to offer support to Hannah when she needs it, and also when you want to provide it so that it's not having a negative impact on you and yourself.
[00:17:08] I have, obviously I've got, um, a wonderful husband.
[00:17:11] I've got three children and I've got, um, a great family and friends as well. So I do use those, um, to support me when I need it. I also have a great. A lot of colleagues as well. Um, being at Moab, we are a smaller site, so we have a lot of, um, support from our man, our managers, um, and the other, my colleague managers, fellow managers on the other wards as well.
[00:17:38] Um. So, you know, they're my debrief people at work, and I've got my family and friends when I go home. Uh, we did offer, you know, obviously we've got our employee assist program that we, you know, ask staff to use if they feel they need it. Um, but. When times get tough sometimes you just, I know you, you face it, and we do it together, and I know I've got my team's back and my team know I've got their back as well.
[00:18:08] Hannah, um, h what if, what impact, if any, have the challenges that you've had? To face had on your mental health.
[00:18:19] I think that I've been very mindful of taking quite a proactive stance on it all. Um. But you know, growing up I grew up on a farm. We experienced tough life, drought and all the rest of it. So, um, I'll say it's probably something that was a little bit like water off a duck's back.
[00:18:40] Um, because at, at the time, all I had to do is just. Show up, do treatment and just keep going. So, um, you know, taking that proactive step of going to my gp, getting the mental health care plan, um, accessing, uh, psychologists through the hospital as well. I know that, um, at midwifery for the large graduate team that I was a part of, and they offered, they got psychology team.
[00:19:10] In, um, to the tea room and anyone that who wanted to go could go to that. Um, but as Mel said, you know, friends, family, all the supports are there. So all I just do is keep being open and honest and transparent, and then hoping that people will do that with me so that if I don't pick up something, I'm really hoping that someone else will and will tap me on the shoulder and say, Hey, go get yourself.
[00:19:34] Go get yourself looked after.
[00:19:36] Yeah, it sounds like you've got a lot of people that are willing to do that for you. Two more questions, ladies. Uh, Melissa, what advice would you offer other leaders in the organisation around how you balance the tension sometimes of supporting a colleague in some of the personal challenges that they might be going through and the operational requirements from a business perspective?
[00:20:01] I
[00:20:02] don't know. I think we just have to just be honest and have that, um, line of communication with your manager as well, because at the end of the day, my DCO general manager, um, they have my back and they will support me. Um, so I think we just need to have that open communication, um, and keep everyone posted and, you know, sometimes others have other experiences and that they can bring to the table to offer.
[00:20:31] Other methods of managing a situation. I think that's probably the best, the best thing in that. That's what we have here, definitely at Moab.
[00:20:41] What advice would you offer anyone who listens to this conversation that works for Monash Health that might be going through, uh, a challenge, and it could be health related, and they're reluctant or nervous, or even scared of talking to somebody about it?
[00:20:57] Given your circumstances and your experience, what advice would you offer?
[00:21:01] I think that there's never going to be a right time to have those conversations. Um, the nerves will never go. The fear will never go even when, you know, on a very real level, after you've done it a few times, that it will be fine.
[00:21:16] The nerves are always still going to be there, so that it's completely okay to still feel those feelings, but sometimes it just needs to be done. Um, and that. The support that you can get after you've had the conversations makes the conversation itself so much more worthwhile because no one can help you unless they know what's going on.
[00:21:41] Um, and even if it's that person themselves who cannot support you for whatever reason, they will know someone who can and at least point you in the right direction.
[00:21:51] Great answer. Great answer. Final question, ladies, to both of you. I'll start with you, Hannah, and then finish with you. Melissa, what is the best thing about working with Monash Health,
[00:22:01] the team?
[00:22:03] Easy. Not even, not even a second thought. My colleagues are the best.
[00:22:08] Melissa?
[00:22:09] Um, I would agree, uh, with Hannah, I've been here. 27, 28 years now. Um, and the colleagues, they're life friends, um, wherever you go, they're with you. Um, we spend more time together than often with our families, um, and we go through some pretty tough times.
[00:22:27] So we are really truly bonded together. We laugh a lot, but we also cry a lot together as well. And I think that's what makes, um, the nurses bond so special.
[00:22:38] Could sit and talk. Laugh with you two. Probably even cry if I needed to. Uh, uh. It's been a pleasure, ladies. Um, Hannah, can we just say, um, just every success in the future, um, hopefully things continue to head in the right direction.
[00:22:53] Um, you're, you're an inspiring young lady. Given the challenges you've got, what strikes me as your. Smile, your positive outlook, your engaging personality, and to you, Melissa, the world's a better place, having leaders that step up and support people in the way that you have done and continue to do for Hannah.
[00:23:11] So thank you very much ladies. When I am in Moab on the Ward, I expect and I would love to be able to exchange a hug with both of you.
[00:23:19] Thank you, Wayne, for your time and for letting us share our story. Yeah, we'll see you on the ward.
[00:23:24] Look forward to it.
[00:23:25] Thank you. See ya.
[00:23:26] Hey,
[00:23:27] thanks for listening, and as we wrap up this phase of the Thrive Podcast series, we'd like to thank you for joining us on this journey of authentic, genuine, and practical conversations about mental health and wellbeing.
[00:23:39] From building trust and psychological safety to embracing vulnerability, self-awareness, and the power of listening. Each episode has offered insights to help us show up for ourselves and each other, especially in the complex and demanding world of healthcare. But these conversations don't end here. Keep listening, keep sharing, keep talking.
[00:24:00] And most importantly, keep supporting one another because together we can continue to create a culture that values wellbeing, compassion, and connection. And finally, thank you for being part of Monash Health Thrive community.
